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Where is Love?
in the bank...

An Intimate Conversation with Robert T. Kiyosaki,
Best-Selling author and leader of the Cash Flow Revolution
Guest Host: Mari Smith,

Segment 2 Interview continued ...


Viveca: Based on results, do you know where to find love?  Pretend the game of life is an expanded version of Monopoly ...  First of all, do you like Monopoly, or do you avoid it? 


Next, are your activities taking you out of the rat race, or are you just hanging on and hoping for the best?  We’ll return with Robert Kiyosaki.  Our conversation continues around cash flow, contribution, teenagers and boundaries. 


I want to give a warm welcome here to Buck, Jr.  Welcome, Buck, Jr.!


Buck Jr. is a regular guest host on the Get Ready For Love Show!Buck, Jr.: Hey, Viveca!


Viveca: We’re having a grand conversation here with Robert Kiyosaki.


Buck, Jr.: Hello, Robert!

Robert K: Hello!


Buck, Jr.: It’s a pleasure to talk to you here.

Robert K: Oh, thank you.  Mine, too.


Buck, Jr.: Thanks for coming on the show.


Viveca: We’re going to chomp into CASHFLOW here.  Buck, Jr., have you played CASHFLOW?


Buck, Jr.: I haven’t played CASHFLOW, but I did read Robert’s book about – um, I’d say about two and a half years ago when I was in Europe.


Viveca: Well, you’ve got more to look forward to.  And I saw on your website, Robert, that world record CASHFLOW 101 with a thousand participants? 

Robert K: Right.


Viveca: That is fantastic! 

Robert K: Yeah.  The New York Times ran a full-page story on it in February of this year, and they’re writing about how the game is spreading throughout the world.  The game is then fulfilling its mission, because it’s supposed to teach people the same thing as my Rich Dad taught me, and it can teach it repetitively.  If you’re just going to play it once, it’s really not worth much.  But if you play it a full good ten times, I think you’‘ll find your thinking changing.


Viveca: I want to let people know that if they go to, they can easily get information to find a CASHFLOWgame that’s near their city or in their city. 

Robert K: Right.  You know – well, the game is pretty expensive.  It’s 200 bucks.  So if you can, find somebody who has the game, and play it for free. 

Viveca: I played for – I had a group that formed, Robert, I mean, with my friend, Mafe.  I used to drive 45 minutes once a week and we’d all gather ‘round.  I remember the first CASHFLOW or the second – probably the second or third, because everyone was --– it was almost an emotional experience for me.  One of them, I saw where my $75,000 inheritance went – 

Robert K: (Laughter)


Viveca:  – and I drove home for 45 minutes in silence.  I did not know what to do with my fury! 

Robert K: That’s why – you know, I’m so sorry you lost your money.  But for many people, they play it four or five times, and a lot of stuff comes up for them.


Viveca: Oh, oh.  And our facilitator would say – he would always say, “Forgive yourself.”  At the end of the game, just whatever happened, you didn’t know any better.  Just forgive yourself. 

Robert K: Or learn from it, you know.


Viveca: Exactly.

Robert K: If you learn from it, you get more – you get stronger.


Viveca: And I learned from that (laughter)!  But there’s many a time I left that game like ecstatic or really, really mad, but I kept playing it! 

Robert K: That’s good, and that’s why games are so important.  That’s why chess was designed, to teach royalty how to be soldiers, how to be strategic bankers.


Viveca: I never knew that!


Mari S: Hmmm...makes sense. Robert, what inspired you to bring out the kids’ version? 

Robert K: Well, I think that’s where we have to make the changes, because your children are going to face a far different financial world than we ever did.  I mean, I’m a Baby Boomer.  The reason your children will face a real tough world is because your competitor can now live in China, you know, somebody competing for your job, and they can work for a lot less. 

The second thing is what we have done, Social Security and Medicare, is we have passed on the debt to the younger generation.  So it’s estimated that if you’re working at 2020, by 2025, 50 percent of your income will go to Social Security and Medicare.  That’s before State taxes and Federal taxes --


Viveca: That’s horrifying! 

Robert K:  just to keep the old guys alive!  So that’s why your kids face a far different economic challenge than we ever did.  So they’ve got to be far more financially savvy. 


Viveca:  I think another great thing about the cash flow game is that it taught me about teamwork, and working with people and how to make deals.  I didn’t know how to do any of that stuff! 

Robert K: Right.  And that’s – you know, like when I was in school, I was a C and F student --


Viveca: (Laughter) 

Robert K:  – and at test time, I was very uncooperative!  The teachers called that cheating, you know!  (Laughter all around) But in the real life, that’s how the rich get ahead is, they sit next to the smartest people, you know, the people that become accountants and attorneys, you know, analysts, and stuff like this.   

So I don’t – I never had to be the smart person, but I had to be able to sit next to smart people.  And I mean so many people, the reason they’re struggling financially is because they’re taking financial advice from two types of people.  One are poor people and two are salespeople, like financial planners and stockbrokers and things like that, and real estate brokers.  The reason I call them “brokers,” is because they’re broker than you are!  (Laughter all around) 

So I’m not saying that they’re bad, because I loved my brokers.  I love my stockbroker and all this.  But I’ve still got to understand why I’m buying certain things and why they’re good and why they’re bad.  So a lot of people just turn their whole – you know, like, “Oh, you’re a financial planner!  Let me give you all my money!”  Then you wonder why when the stock market crashes, you’ve lost everything.


Viveca: Do you think it’s rude if I ask my financial planner what they’re invested in and to show me what they’re doing?  Is that a rude question? 

Robert K: I think you should absolutely ask them that question, and ask them if they stopped working, how long could they survive.


Viveca: I had one where I asked a man – he really was offended, and – 

Robert K: Why?


Viveca:  – he made me feel badly.  But I wouldn’t work with him, then, because of that.  I thought, if he won’t show me or tell me, then – 

Robert K: Yeah.  How can he advise you?


Viveca: That’s what I thought. 

Robert K: Like I’m – I’m 40 pounds overweight, and that would be me telling you how to lose weight!  (Laughter all around) That’s the trouble with weight, because it’s obvious this guy doesn’t know what he’s talking about!  (Laughter all around)

It’s the same as relationships, too.  I mean, no offense, but a lot of times, people giving relationship advice have no relationships.


Mari S: Uh-huh.


Viveca: Yes.   

Robert K: You know, I mean, the person that – I won’t mention her name.  She was famous for talking about marriage, but was married nine thousand times!  (Laughter all around) I guess that made her an expert, but not a relationship expert!  (Laughter all around)


Viveca: She knows how to get married!  Hats off to that! 

Robert K: I’ll tell you, one of the biggest compliments I ever got was this friend’s – not a friend, but an associate’s wife said, “Oh, that Kiyosaki, he’s the biggest chauvinist woman hater I ever met in my life!”  Then my friend says, “I want you to see something rather than think something.  Look at his business partners.”  My business partners are all very smart, tough women!  And he said, “If he was a chauvinist, those women would kill him!”  (Laughter all around)   

And I’ve always taken that as a compliment, because it’s not about gender, it’s about who is the best on your team!  I have very strong women on my team.


Viveca: That’s total equity!  And I’m really hoping that Kim can come on a later date with us!  So I’m not saying I can’t – I’ll be calling your office next week.  I’m sorry she couldn’t be with us this evening. 

Robert K: Please do that, you know, because I keep – she’s good looking, she’s smart, and she is the real reason I’m successful!  (Laughter all around)  I mean this.  I met a guy today and he says, “Why are you on the show?  I would rather see your wife.”  I said, “Me, too!”  (Laughter all around)


Viveca: Tell him just wait a little while,  and we are going to work this out!

Robert K: Yeah.


Viveca: I met her – I met her very briefly probably a couple of years ago, and she was so genuine and so warm. 

Robert K:  That’s – she’s that way all the time, 24/7.


Viveca: You can tell that about somebody when they’re that way or when they’re pretending.  She’s just totally there.


Mari K: Yeah. 

Robert K: Yeah.  You know, my mother was fat, short and dumpy, but she was as loving as Kim is.  So I actually did marry a woman like my mom.  Thank God, she didn’t look like my mom (laughter)!  But I married – I married a woman who is extremely loving, and extremely kind and very patient.  That’s what I personally needed, you know.


Mari K: Um.  You know, Robert, I think that Kim is really a profound example of how an empowered woman financially – of her taking control of her own finances.  In some of your books, I was reading that really, you grew together, but independently, and that she has her own entity and her own real estate business.  What – I know you said it doesn’t necessarily matter about gender, but what do you think – what advice do you have to empower women, in particular, financially?  Do you think it’s a good thing to keep your money separate like that?   

Robert K: Well, it depends upon the couple, you know.  It depends upon the relationship, because nobody is a saint.  I know for me, I did not want a woman who wanted me to take care of her -- not personal.  I know there’s men who want their women to be -- you know, what’s that,  pregnant and barefooted?  I guess it’s a matter of choice.  Well, I didn’t want that.  And I knew the kind of woman I wanted had to be gorgeous, smart, self – you know, independent, not needy, all that stuff.    

But it’s a choice.  My friend is married to a woman who just likes raising her kids.  And, you know, I would go nuts, personally, but they’re really happy with their relationship.  So it depends.


Viveca: Uh-huh. 

Robert K: I married a business partner!  (Laughter all around) She’s first my best friend, she’s my business partner and then she’s my wife!


Mari S: Aha!  That’s the secret! 

Robert K: Yeah.  And when we play golf, I make sure she tees off with the men!  (Laughter all around) But I told her, I said, “Look, don’t buy into the men stuff, where they let the women have a – you know, a tee, the red tees, whatever they are.  Don’t buy into that male chauvinist stuff, you know.  Stand with the men and kick their butt!”  She just loved it!  She just loved it!  (Laughter all around) 

Now, there are a lot of women who say that’s chauvinistic.  So it’s – it’s different.  Everything is different.


Viveca: I think that’s gutsy! 

Robert K: What is really embarrassing, now, is my wife out drives myself and her father (laughter)!  The male ego is fragile, you know!  But she took it too hard.  I said, “Don’t get stuck into this male point of view that you’re weaker than us!”   

I mean, who designs golf courses?  Men!  And why do they put the woman’s tee shorter?  Because they think that’s what they should do.  But my wife tees off from the back tees. 


Viveca: You know what I’m picking up here, Robert?  You’re reminding me – I had this great post.  We have a Get Ready For Love tribe on the Internet, and there was a post earlier this week by a woman.  One thing she said in terms of what does she love about her life is that she loves herself.  I can just tell that you just love yourself and you enjoy yourself, and that is such a great feeling! 

Robert K: Well, it’s more than love it.  It’s to be true to what I know about myself, you know.


Viveca: Yes! 

Robert K: And I don’t try to be what I’m not, and I think that’s...  And my wife is my best friend.  We have the best time.


Mari S: Um.  You know, it’s been said that your self-worth determines your net worth.  I think you do have to feel good about yourself to... 

Robert K: (Laughter) Yeah.  And I tell you, you know, the last transaction my wife closed, you know, it was a seven million dollar transaction.  She borrowed seven million dollars.  I was shaking, and she was as calm as a cucumber!  The board of people have changed!  The tables have changed here, you know!  (Laughter all around)


Mari S: That’s funny! 

Robert K: So the point here is this: I don’t think in this world that women are the weaker sex.  That’s something that people bought into.


Mari S: Um. 

Robert K: You know, I mean, we all have our strengths and we all have our weaknesses, but one is not stronger, you know. 


Viveca: You know, we make a great team when we’re all together!


I have a question for you about – a final question from me on the game is that a big part of getting out of the rat race is tithing and contribution. 

Robert K: Yeah.  Right. 


Viveca:   And “Where Is Love?  It’s In the Bank,” it’s in the bank of our deeds or our actions. 

Robert K: Right.


Viveca: Could you comment on tithing, and... 

Robert K: Well, it’s a very simple principle.  It’s God’s principle.  It’s the law of reciprocity.  So if you want a smile, you give a smile.  But if you say, “Well, nobody is smiling at me,” it’s  because you’re not smiling!  I mean, it’s real simple, right?


Mari S: Uh-huh. 

Robert K: And if I want a punch in the mouth, the fastest way for me to get one is go start throwing one, which I have done.  (Laughter all around) Or if I want insults thrown back at me, I just throw insults first.  

Well, the same thing counts with money.  If you want money, you need to give money to something that inspires you spiritually.  So it could be a church.  It could be a charity, you know.  It’s not your own bank account!  It’s a church, something like... 

I give to Greenpeace, simply because I love the ocean so much.  But I’m not working there.  It’s my money that goes to them.  My money works there.  I hear people say, “Well, I don’t give money, I give my time.”  Generally, those are people who have a lot of time, because they’re getting back what they give.   

So the rule is the rule of reciprocity.  Give what you want.  If you want a punch in the mouth, give one.  Do you want money?  Give money.   

And a lot of people say, “Well, I’ll give money when I have money.”  And the reason that they don’t have money is because they’re not giving money.


Viveca: That’s what I was going to ask.   

Robert K: Yeah.


Buck, Jr.: Robert, what would you say to people who are like minimum wage employees who are trying to, you know, get to the other side of the cash flow quadrant or something like that?  What do you say to them? 

Robert K: About giving?


Buck, Jr.: Well, yeah, about the giving, and then getting started towards moving to the other side.   

Robert K: Well, they have to give and they have to learn and they have to study.  I mean, we’ve been – we’ve been programmed since going to school and kindergarten is to go to school and get a job.  We’ve been programmed to be employees.  And we’ve been programmed to be selfish, you know, to study by ourselves and get our own grades.   

So there’s a couple lessons of life to pass on.  There are three kinds of money:  There’s competitive money, and that’s where we learn to compete for grades, compete for jobs and compete for money.  There’s  cooperative money, and a share of stock is cooperative money created by rich guys who go and form a company, and stock becomes money.  And there’s spiritual money, and that’s money from trusting in God and giving.  So you have to start giving.  

The other thing – the mistake that people make is the difference between a job and your work.  A job is what you get paid for, and work is what you do to get ahead.  So that’s why it’s called homework or housework or yardwork.  The reason so many ghettos are poor is they have no jobs, but they have a lot of work to do, and they will not do the work.   

So a lot of people will not do their homework, you know.  They don’t study or they don’t read books or they don’t read magazines or they don’t attend seminars.  They don’t play cash ballgames.  They still kind of hope that if they work hard enough at their job, they’ll get rich.   

But that’s not the way it works.  You still have to do your homework, and you have to do your homework which gets you ahead, but you don’t get paid for it.


Buck, Jr.: So what would you recommend to somebody just starting out in something like that -- 

Robert K: Work for free.


Buck, Jr.:  – if they can’t afford to get that $200 game, but maybe the book, or.... 

Robert K: Work for free!  Go get a – you know, go work at something you want to learn!  You know, I mean, go to the library.  Sign up for the CASHFLOW game for free.  But you have to get off your butt and go do something! 

See, you have to do your homework.  It doesn’t take money, you know.


Viveca: When I started off with a game, I think I paid twenty dollars to go play the game. 

Robert K: What’s that? 


Viveca:  When I started with the game, I paid ten or twenty dollars per game.

Mari S: Uh-huh, yeah, same here.


Viveca; That was great! 

Robert K: Somebody was charging you money?


Viveca: Yeah.


Mari S: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah!


Viveca: Because they included food.  We had kind of a luxury game. 

Robert K: Included, oh, okay.  That was included (laughter)!


Mari S: No, we had training, I mean, the ones where they included training!  They show your video and charge us ten dollars to watch, eh? 

Robert K: Wow!  (Laughter all around)


Mari S: It’s worth it!  It’s worth it!


Viveca: You started this whole infrastructure (laughter)! 

Robert K: Right.   Anyway, I have found the more I – the more I give, the more I – you know, Spencer Fuller said, “The more people you serve, the more effective you become.”  So the business decisions inside our company, it’s not about how much money we can make.  It’s about how many people can we serve at the best price.


Viveca: I love that!  Let’s hold there.  We’re going to come back with the love story!


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(c) copyright 2004-2006 Get Ready For Love! Radio * All Rights Reserved * interview with Robert T. Kiyosaki